Natural Brumation

[zebraflavencs]

Hope they are back to normal soon !
Good luck !

 

[Debbe]

Should I create a "cave" space? Only the baby (4-6 months old) is showing signs of not wanting to get up in the morning, and sleeping throughout the day. The other two are as active as ever.

 

[staylor]

It is my understanding that babies normally don't brumate.

 

[crypticdragons]

Should I create a "cave" space? Only the baby (4-6 months old) is showing signs of not wanting to get up in the morning, and sleeping throughout the day. The other two are as active as ever.

first and foremost you need to get a fecal sample checked by a qualified vet. At that age in captivity it is less likely for them to brumate. Sure it has happened but 90% of the time it is something besides brumation (such as insufficient uv light, improper heat, and/or parasites)

 

[Debbe]

already done, since I read that the poo wasnt suppose to smell. no parasites. light is sufficient, uv is new (2 months old).

 

[Polly]

Hiya, my 2 year old male beardie has slowed down a lot on his eating lately, I'm in New Zealand so it's just going into winter and I'm wondering whether he's starting to semi-brumate (he's not completely inactive, and his former owner said he's never really gone into full brumation) but I was just wondering when they do slow down on eating, how little is too little? For the last few days his daily food intake has been a few peas one day, 1 pea the next, a pea and a slice of zucchini, and then today all he's has is 2 slices of zucchini. I've offered him plenty of other stuff and he just hasn't been interested (he closes his eyes if I offer him something he doesn't want.) So yeah, just wanted to know if this is too little even if he's beginning to brumate.

 

[packfan74]

I'm on the East Coast in the US. We're in the beginnings of Fall here (quite beautiful!). Our outside temps are in the high 70s daytime (sunny) / mid 50s nite (dewy) - perfect in my book!

My 17 month old is in and out of his brumation box now - sleepy most of the day, doesn't really want to eat. Does manage to take a very small amount of liquid veg & 1-3 dusted supers every other day or so; not drinking; soaks for 15 min every 2-3 days. Poos twice a wk.

So far I've kept his light schedule almost the same (11 hrs on / 13 hrs off). Tank temps r 100F hot side / 80F cool. Tank nite temps are 75F (inside his box).

Last yr @ this time when he was only 6-7 months, he acted like he wanted to brumate but never really went full blown into it - not even in the dead of winter (December-March). He never spent more than 2 days in his box. This yr. he's starting to slow down a tad bit early. QUESTION: Should I just let him do his thing or is it too early in MY AREA...keeping in mind we have 4-5 months of winter ahead of us thus, we won't see above 80F temps again til Spring - in mid May!

Do I shut down his lights completely now or back off slowly? Do I take him out of his box to feed at any time? What about soaks - do I skip them while he's brumating?

Just need some general guidelines on Brumation for US, East Coasters - THANKS.

 

[richard]

technically they dont have to brumate unless you are going to breed them however if you choose to do so, then back the lights of slowly. if you normally turn off at 9pm then do 8 for a week then 7 for a week then 6 for a week then just leave off and cover the tank to keep it dark. it is my personal recommendation and preference that you brumate no longer than two months and using a syringe without the needle of course, give them about 1cc of water once a week wether they want it or not. brumation makes them susceptible to dehydration and that is very bad and expensive to recover from. (i learned the hard way) also while you are cutting there lights back, cut back on food and if you can get some lactulose from your vet, give it to them once or twice during the last week to make them poop and clean them out. you dont want feces sitting in their bowels for that long of time. some people will tell you to use olive oil but all that does is grease them up a bit. the lactulose actually stimulates a bowel movement. its like dragon ex-lax. wolfman Tom hopefully will chime in on this one as well.

 

[packfan74]

I mixed Cod Liver Oil into his liquid veg. Does that also work like Lactulose?

My guy doesn't eat raw veg on his own (long story). I've had to feed him via a syringe daily for the last 10 months. He use to get jar baby food. Now I make my own - the base is kale, then I add water & 2-3 other items such as carrots, apples and other greens, etc. Each wk I change it up a bit but I always add in a teaspoon of Cod Liver Oil....makes him smell kinda fishy though .

QUESTION: When you say give them water via a syringe whether or not they want it - do you mean force their mouth open and administer it down or do you mean give it drop by drop on the nose until they drink it (or until it runs out)? The latter is how I feed.

Also, I have started to back off the light schedule already, that's why at this point we're @ 13 hrs. off so far.

 

[richard]

hi packfan, all my guys are adults and dont go for that drop on the nose trick so i gently pull on the beard and they open up. i personally do believe in prying the mouth open with a finger nail or other object as that can cause injury. you can use a soft rubber spatula to do it that way if you choose. anyway, i tug on the beard, they get mad and open up. sometimes you can use your thumb and forefinger to "pinch" the nostrils and lift upwards HOWEVER, if you are not careful, that way can get you bit.

 

[packfan74]

Ha ha, the bit part - he's never bitten or even attempted but I can see how the nostril thing might not be a good idea!

I too pull on his beard but he fights it! I have to pull pretty hard before he gives in and opens up. I've used a spatula in the past but find it too cumbersome (its a two person job). It's much easier to cover his head w/a towel (so he can't see it coming). He's been there done that too many times w/panacur - if he sees it coming, he spikes out too early, making it hard to hold him. As is, he gets quite mad afterwards regardless. He'll back up, plant all 4s, hunch over, puff up, spike out and go black. Then he looks at me as if to say, "what the freak Mom!"

Any thoughts on the cod oil vs. lactulose?

 

[richard]

cod liver oil was recommended to me by my vet when i run out of lactulose. i keep the lactulose on hand for emergency. its not expensive and it also help to remove ammonia and other contaminants from the liver.

 

[packfan74]

Oh that's right - u r the 1 who suggested it 2 me when he ate a pebble a couple of months ago. BTW, saw yur doc, cost me $200 for x-rays! No pebble . Had 2 take him back afew wks ago - he jumped off our 2nd story deck when nobody was looking; we tought a hawk got him . Apparently he landed on the neighbors fence, promptly fell off (about 8 feet down), landed on a concrete patio, spent 6 hrs. in 45 degree temps looking for him, found him in the woods @ midnight.....in the ice cold RAIN! Presumably soar and brused took him to the vet. MEGA bucks $$$ - don't ask, seriously NOT funny! He's fine now but grumpier - hoping its cuz of brumation and not due to his brush w/death in the wild out back - ha!

Still looking for advice on East Coast brumation:

* Lights off for 2 months, yes or no?
If yes, when do I start; from when-to-when?

* What's the rule on food, water and soaks.

* Do I use a brumation box or not?
Somebody told me to put him in a shoe box and stick him in the closet
for a month.........really, is that even safe?

 

[richard]

the post above explains how i do it.

 

[richard]

sorry, im starting to change my light schedule now so the can actually start sleeping first week of november then ill start waking them up after christmas.

 

[dallin]

my bearded dragon has been sleeping for about a month now and i have been turning the light on like usual. Is that a bad idea?

 

[kaykayy]

i found this post really helpful as my 2 10 month old beardies r sooo lazy atm all they want to do is hide and i keep thinkin thier unhappy...i get them out loads and once they r out of the tank they seem alot better...sounds like my guys r goin thru the signs of brumation then, i bath them twice a week n mist every day...to keep hydration up too