Can I provide too much UVB

[Red Ink AUS]

Hi guys,

Any thoughts on the overload of UVB in an enclosure, the going census seems to be YES?

What are you thoughts on the matter.

 

[[email protected]]

dont have any ideal---- but one hour of direct sunlight is the equivent of 10 hours of bulb time for uva uvb absortion

 

[SoleSky]

Found this a bit helpful.
http://www.redtailboa.net/forums/caging-housing-reptiles-husbandry-items/9547-too-much-uvb.html

 

[staylor]

I have no idea, this is one of those questions I wait for you to answer

 

[Craiger]

Curious to know the answer to this myself. Have those that have stated "yes" given any information backing up why they think that way?

 

[zebraflavencs]

Hypercalcemia comes to mind.

 

[Craiger]

Hypercalcemia comes to mind.

I thought that was from just administering too much calcium. Or is it that, paired with offering too much calcium, an overdose of UVB causes Hypercalcemia?

 

[staylor]

I know what hypercalcemia is...that was one of my vocabulary words this week for my medical terminology class.

Like your thinking Janie. If they get too much UVB then it could cause them to absorb too much calcium causing the hypercalcemia. Is that what you were thinking?

 

[Red Ink AUS]

Out of all the yes sayers I have come across i have never been given a satisfactory answer to the question. Hypercalcemia can definitely occur but that is a dietary condition. I have come accross this rethoric on a lot of forums and seems to be an accepted answer that you can provide them too much UV in the enclosure without ever questioning why, seems to be "you just can".

Now consider this.
No man made lighting system can equate to the spectral output of the sun, well at least nothing that you can pick up from a petshop.
The spectral output in UVB intensity of the sun is far greater than any tube or MVB, the laws of physics can not be bent no matter what the marketing department tells us or what the other person halfway accross the world on a forum says.
The lux intensity and micowatt output of the sun in regards to UVB is the same at 10 inches from the ground and at 100 meters in the air. You need to ensure that BDs get within 8 inches if a Reptisun 10.0 for it to be effective any further and it is not as good. So can I really put too much UVB in an enclosure?

 

[beardielover17]

I always wondered about the to much UVB and I myself have said yes you can. Usually in most of the situations where I've said yes was when a person wanted a MVB and a UVB in the same spot. I figured that since both bulbs would be focused in the same spot it may give off too strong of UV. Not sure if that's the case but I've also heard that dragons shouldn't get "x" amount of inches from certain bulbs because of UVC so I figured "too much UVBs" would create a similar situation. I could definitely be wrong and would love to learn

 

[ladyknite]

I'll chime in here with a few comments to add and a question or two.

Although no man made bulb can equate the power of nature, in many captive enclosures there is no escape from the constant exposure. Things aren't like this in nature, only in captivity. How many enclosures have UVB bulbs run the length of the enclosure, or used in combination with MVB's? How many owners allow their dragons time to escape from the rays of the "fake sun" without fear or panic? It's my belief that it's not the exposure to UVB that's problem, but overexposure to an inferior substitute (remember the latest bulb recalls) with no refuse in addition to over supplementation and improper balance in the diet.

Hypercalcemia has too many causes to be directly related to UVB, and if it were present, I would suspect the thyroid or at least over supplementation before i suspected the bulb i was using or the exposure to it. D3 is a natural thing made within. Build up of synthetics destroy the thyroid. To D3 or not to D3? I guess that's the next question.

Now, in my enclosures I run a 10.0 the length of the enclosure that shuts down mid day for a couple of hours. this is the time my dragons retreat to hides and cool sides of the tank. Do they go because their "fake sun" disappeared or because it's in their nature?

 

[Red Ink AUS]

I'll chime in here with a few comments to add and a question or two.

Although no man made bulb can equate the power of nature, in many captive enclosures there is no escape from the constant exposure. Things aren't like this in nature, only in captivity. How many enclosures have UVB bulbs run the length of the enclosure, or used in combination with MVB's? How many owners allow their dragons time to escape from the rays of the "fake sun" without fear or panic? It's my belief that it's not the exposure to UVB that's problem, but overexposure to an inferior substitute (remember the latest bulb recalls) with no refuse in addition to over supplementation and improper balance in the diet.

Hypercalcemia has too many causes to be directly related to UVB, and if it were present, I would suspect the thyroid or at least over supplementation before i suspected the bulb i was using or the exposure to it. D3 is a natural thing made within. Build up of synthetics destroy the thyroid. To D3 or not to D3? I guess that's the next question.

Now, in my enclosures I run a 10.0 the length of the enclosure that shuts down mid day for a couple of hours. this is the time my dragons retreat to hides and cool sides of the tank. Do they go because their "fake sun" disappeared or because it's in their nature?

I was hoping you'd catch this thread mate, very interesting and invaluably valid points you have made, and as you know I run the same lighting cycle as you. I use to only do it over the warmer periods but now I just leave it like that year round (except during brumation).

I think this is a notion that needs to be corrected as in "blaming the source to too much UVB" there's no such thing. What isn't being provided is the availability of escape or choice for the specimens in my opinion.
Another common misconception i believe among rhetorical keepers is that D3 comes from the UVB source, but as you pointed out this is a methabolic result from diet and exoposure to UV.

 

[Craiger]

Another common misconception i believe among rhetorical keepers is that D3 comes from the UVB source, but as you pointed out this is a methabolic result from diet and exoposure to UV.

That's the way I understood it....D3 being made naturally as a result of UV exposure. I also understand that humans benefit from D3 being made metabolically from UV exposure....and it's likely that we don't get enough due to fears of skin diseases such as melanoma. When, in fact, we should be exposing ourselves to more UV to keep bone diseases at bay. And, like anything else, too much of a good thing could be deadly.

 

[ladyknite]

I think this is a notion that needs to be corrected as in "blaming the source to too much UVB" there's no such thing. What isn't being provided is the availability of escape or choice for the specimens in my opinion.
Another common misconception i believe among rhetorical keepers is that D3 comes from the UVB source, but as you pointed out this is a methabolic result from diet and exoposure to UV.

Unfortunately, there's not much fight against what years of rhetorical information has embedded. Changing that information is like going up against a politician. It's all about post count and popularity, not clarity of information anymore.

 

[Red Ink AUS]

I think this is a notion that needs to be corrected as in "blaming the source to too much UVB" there's no such thing. What isn't being provided is the availability of escape or choice for the specimens in my opinion.
Another common misconception i believe among rhetorical keepers is that D3 comes from the UVB source, but as you pointed out this is a methabolic result from diet and exoposure to UV.

Unfortunately, there's not much fight against what years of rhetorical information has embedded. Changing that information is like going up against a politician. It's all about post count and popularity, not clarity of information anymore.

LOL of all the forums I am on (even OZ ones) I have the highest post count on here. This is a nice place with open minded peeps. It doesn't take a Degree in science to make observations and peice together common known information all it takes is an inquisitive mind .