My adult bearded dragon DIED? mystified! HELP!

[SamTX]

My adult bearded dragon DIED? mystified!?
HELP!!!
I am a beginner to bearded dragon (started reading ab 1 month a go). Long story short: I got an adult bearded dragon (7" body to head;16" total) and tank last night. I was told is a sandfire dragon and shedding ( i can see the sheded skin while cleaning).
So I decided to clean the tank and put in a mat. I place him outside in the sun, in a blue big, huge plastic container (about 75 gal big) while i clean the tank. He started to get a bit aggressive and tried to get out, running around. I don't hear anything after about 30-45 mins and he got stiffed, unresponsive, eyes closed partially.
I think he is dead, but WHY? HOW?

extra info: last night was uneventful, this morning he is not active but responsive. Came for lunch when i put in chopped broccoli, green bell pepper, cucumber, blueberry (not been eaten). He ated a little. His beard is very black when trying to get out of the plastic case, and still is. The container was previously use for clothing when moved. Outside temp is listed 86F at 2 hrs later (3-4 pm), TX weather.
I'm stumped. I thought the sun was supposed to be good the dragon. Did it died to exhaustion? de-hydrated? Fear (from the bird sounds and such outside)???

any ideas? anyone???

 

[renich]

So sorry for your loss and sorry you had to join the forum under these circumstances.

What kind of plastic container did you use? Did you have a top on the container?

It is very possible that he overheated when outside in the container. Beardies need a mesh viv when outdoors.

 

[SamTX]

So sorry for your loss and sorry you had to join the forum under these circumstances.

What kind of plastic container did you use? Did you have a top on the container?

It is very possible that he overheated when outside in the container. Beardies need a mesh viv when outdoors.

No, it was wide open. The opening is large than the 40L tank I was cleaning. As i said, the weather was not that hot.
It's been 3 hrs and still no sign of life.
WHY, HOW??? :-(

 

[SamTX]

I meant 40 gal.
Still no sign of life and going to the vet is too costly.
I current theory is it died of overheat because I did not put in a shade for it to cool down
OR from heat shock from 74F indoor to 80-90F outside in direct sun. (total time in the plastic cont, in the sun is about 60-90 mins).
If that is the case, it is not as "hardy" as i was impressed upon the readings! I did not find any mention of providing a shade while direct sun bathing from online materials.

It can stand temp of 100-110F or so, right?
I guess, I may never find the real cause.

 

[Craiger]

I guess, I may never find the real cause.

Without a necropsy (similar to an autopsy, but for animals), I'm afraid this might be the case. As you didn't keep an eye on him while he was outside, it could literally be anything. Without a top on the tub, something could have gotten inside.

While they are hardy (to an extent), they are an animal that depend on us. Perhaps you should hang around here for a while and get a bit more educated on them before thinking about getting another? We'll do everything we can to help.

I'm very sorry for your loss.

 

[li]

A neocropsy would be the only way to be sure and without a complete history it would be tough. My first thought is that he ate something like a firefly or something similar. But that is a guess.
I am really sorry.

 

[SamTX]

A neocropsy would be the only way to be sure and without a complete history it would be tough. My first thought is that he ate something like a firefly or something similar. But that is a guess.
I am really sorry.

True, they are animal. I figure they are hardy enough for me to take on while learning about them. I've taken care of fish tanks and ponds before, so i understand degree of hardiness to tolerate while learning to take on fishes and such.

so, let's assume that he did not eat anything or there was no other factor. Could 60-90 mins of sun bathing kill an otherwise healthy adult dragon. In other words, what is the likelihood of an adult dragon being terminally overheat from direct sun bathing, 60-90 mins (right about 45-60 mins i stopped hearing anything from the container) in 86F spring time, central texas climate?
It is a low possibility, is it not?

I just can't get it off my mind, feeling (no way to confirm) there was no gross negligence though.

ps: he hadn't moved since. He's dead!
thank you all for posting! I will reconsider a different one in a couple of months. Thanks!

 

[Red Ink AUS]

so, let's assume that he did not eat anything or there was no other factor. Could 60-90 mins of sun bathing kill an otherwise healthy adult dragon. In other words, what is the likelihood of an adult dragon being terminally overheat from direct sun bathing, 60-90 mins (right about 45-60 mins i stopped hearing anything from the container) in 86F spring time, central texas climate?

A there is no possibility that a "healthy" dragon would die of heat exhaustion in 86F basking temperature (no matter how long they bask). 86F isn't even optimum basking temp for them nor is it critically low. There would be an outside factor that precipitated the specimens death.

Sorry for your loss by the way.

 

[Craiger]

so, let's assume that he did not eat anything or there was no other factor. Could 60-90 mins of sun bathing kill an otherwise healthy adult dragon. In other words, what is the likelihood of an adult dragon being terminally overheat from direct sun bathing, 60-90 mins (right about 45-60 mins i stopped hearing anything from the container) in 86F spring time, central texas climate?
It is a low possibility, is it not?

I'm confused. You say he was in the tub, sun bathing for 60 to 90 minutes. Yet, you mention the fact that you stopped hearing something from the container after about 45-60 minutes. Did you not check on him? When you stopped hearing something, did you not look to see if something could be wrong? Was he truly in there for another 30-45 minutes after you stopped hearing him running around?

I just can't get it off my mind, feeling (no way to confirm) there was no gross negligence though.

I'll respond to this after your answers to the above questions.

For future reference, it's true that you can never be educated enough about an animal to truly understand all of their needs. Yet, I'd like to think the others will agree that we should, at least, have a good understanding of their basic needs before acquiring one. I don't trust myself to properly care for something while I'm learning. I'd suggest a good start would be to read through all the links listed on the home page of this site. There's a plethora of information to be found....and, of course, we're here should you need answers you can't find on the site.

 

[SamTX]

so, let's assume that he did not eat anything or there was no other factor. Could 60-90 mins of sun bathing kill an otherwise healthy adult dragon. In other words, what is the likelihood of an adult dragon being terminally overheat from direct sun bathing, 60-90 mins (right about 45-60 mins i stopped hearing anything from the container) in 86F spring time, central texas climate?
It is a low possibility, is it not?

I'm confused. You say he was in the tub, sun bathing for 60 to 90 minutes. Yet, you mention the fact that you stopped hearing something from the container after about 45-60 minutes. Did you not check on him? When you stopped hearing something, did you not look to see if something could be wrong? Was he truly in there for another 30-45 minutes after you stopped hearing him running around?

I just can't get it off my mind, feeling (no way to confirm) there was no gross negligence though.

I'll respond to this after your answers to the above questions.

For future reference, it's true that you can never be educated enough about an animal to truly understand all of their needs. Yet, I'd like to think the others will agree that we should, at least, have a good understanding of their basic needs before acquiring one. I don't trust myself to properly care for something while I'm learning. I'd suggest a good start would be to read through all the links listed on the home page of this site. There's a plethora of information to be found....and, of course, we're here should you need answers you can't find on the site.

He's an adult and new to me. Previous owner dealt in snakes and wanted to get rid of him because got it from a trade, so no history.
(more info: i removed from the tank a fresh wet poop, not runny, this morning)

I did checked on him once or twice after stop hearing from the tub. He just lay there. My assumption is he's just tired and basking (i assumed he stopped because he's tired). I checked on him several time before and spooked him so I did want to check that often (I also keep an eye out while cleaning b/c of remote fear that some bird may get to him). Also my assumption to begin with are: it is not that hot outside; BD likes the to bask in the sun, online materials encouraged sun bathing; and 60 mins is not that long, however i was busy so i think it was 90 mins before I pickup him up to move to the tank after cleaning.

So, it was 86F at 3-4 pm, say about 90F at time of dead, factor in direct sun?? to be 100/105/110F max . That's still not too high for an adult, right?

 

[Red Ink AUS]

So, it was 86F at 3-4 pm, say about 90F at time of dead, factor in direct sun?? to be 100/105/110F max . That's still not too high for an adult, right?

Answered

so, let's assume that he did not eat anything or there was no other factor. Could 60-90 mins of sun bathing kill an otherwise healthy adult dragon. In other words, what is the likelihood of an adult dragon being terminally overheat from direct sun bathing, 60-90 mins (right about 45-60 mins i stopped hearing anything from the container) in 86F spring time, central texas climate?

A there is no possibility that a "healthy" dragon would die of heat exhaustion in 86F basking temperature (no matter how long they bask). 86F isn't even optimum basking temp for them nor is it critically low. There would be an outside factor that precipitated the specimens death.

Sorry for your loss by the way.

Though direct heat may have only been 86F, the actual temps in a plastic tub in direct sun will still be higher. Plastic retains direct heat therefore increasing heat within the tub by convection. So the actual heat experienced by the specimen may have been higher than what was recorded unless measured at the point of contact with the specimen.

 

[Pogie]

I am so sorry for your loss.

When I got Pogie, I also knew nothing, but fortunately I had 2 days from when we said well take her in till the previous owners brought her over.
I spent almost all that time on the internet. Most of the info I got was from bearded dragon forums . . it is better to research from them as it is real people living with real Beardies. Most of the other info on the internet is conflicting and estimates.

I'm sure if you read through the topics on Lighting, Diet, temperatures before getting a new BD, you will be much better prepared.