Force feeding Dehydrated Bearded Dragon during Brumation?

[Ravenbrand]

My bearded dragon a month ago started getting very lethargic, and would start napping more, and would be very lazy and had 0 interest in food whatsoever. He wouldn't sleep 24/7 at the time, but would be lethargic and would nap a lot. It appeared to be brumation, so I was reading up on brumation and read somewhere they typically don't get dehydrated during brumation unless you saw signs, so I didn't bother soaking him.

Then about 2 weeks ago he was being a little more active and that's how I started seeing signs of dehydration, and immediately took him to the vet, where they confirmed he was dehydrated, and that his dehydration was causing constipation, and they gave him an injection to re-hydrate him, kept him for a week and since he still won't eat, they began to syringe feed him to both feed him and keep him hydrated. By now I know I should've been soaking him all this time. They did fecal tests, found no parasites, told me he isn't underweight or emaciated or even sick other than dehydrated. The doctor also demonstrated to me how to syringe feeding him.

The doctor sent me home with powder to mix with water so I could syringe feed him for a few weeks until he started to fully recover from dehydration. But the problem is now that he's at home, he is like in full blown brumation, its extremely hard to wake him up and syringe feed him, the 95%-100% of the day he stays sleep. I tried to wake him up to syringe feed him but it barely works, and stresses him out, because he doesn't cooperate at all and doesn't even wake up when I try. Even when I soak him he doesn't wake up, so I hold his head above water. I also read during brumation you should just leave them alone as much as possible.

So am I disturbing him by trying to syringe force feed him like the doctor told me to? Am I unnecessarily stressing him if I try to wake him up to force feed him even though he doesn't wake up? Should I just start soaking him everyday to make up for the force feeding? The point of force feeding is to keep him hydrated and get rid of the constipation. The doctor is out for now and I don't want to wait for her call back so I'm asking here.

Tank temps: 40 gallon tank, 115 degrees Fahrenheit basking spot, 95 degrees Fahrenheit on the ground on the hot side, 80-85 degrees Fahrenheit on the cool side, he has a undertank heater on one side for when he sleeps.

 

[Canicke]

soaking does not increase hydration. fluids orally increase hydration. if he's not awake - I would not try to force feed him. if the food / fluid goes down the wrong pipe, you could cause more damage than if you just left him be. how old is he? please - get rid of the undertank heater - they do not sense heat on their bellies - so he would not know when he was getting overheated. I ask about the age cuz 115 is a bit high for an adult. I would give water when he wakes. if he wants to eat - add food. brumation is kinda their way of re-charging. and all beardies are different.

 

[Ravenbrand]

soaking does not increase hydration. fluids orally increase hydration. if he's not awake - I would not try to force feed him. if the food / fluid goes down the wrong pipe, you could cause more damage than if you just left him be. how old is he? please - get rid of the undertank heater - they do not sense heat on their bellies - so he would not know when he was getting overheated. I ask about the age cuz 115 is a bit high for an adult. I would give water when he wakes. if he wants to eat - add food. brumation is kinda their way of re-charging. and all beardies are different.

He's going on 4 years old, I bought him May 2013 when he was only a month or two old.

 

[Canicke]

if you click on the links below - you will find some super awesome info put together by a couple of our members.
here is an excerpt on heating :

There should be 3 "zones" basking, warm area and cool area. UVB lighting should cover 2/3rd's of your enclosure, no lights of any color at night as dragons have what is called their "3rd eye" it is a gland on top of their head that detects light/shadows. They need the dark/coolness to get the sleep and cool down that they need. As long as the night time temps don't dip below 65F all is good if it does get a CHE (Ceramic Heating Element) to keep temps up.
http://www.reptilesmagazine.com/Reptile-Health/Habitats-Care/Reptile-Lighting-Information/
Baby Dragons: Basking 100-107F warm 85-95F cool 70-75F
Juv Dragons: Basking anywhere from 95-107F Remember they need it to digest warm 85-95F cool 70F
Adults Basking 90-95F can also be low 100'sF warm 80-90F cool 70F

keep us posted - let us know how he's doin

 

[Ravenbrand]

if you click on the links below - you will find some super awesome info put together by a couple of our members.
here is an excerpt on heating :

There should be 3 "zones" basking, warm area and cool area. UVB lighting should cover 2/3rd's of your enclosure, no lights of any color at night as dragons have what is called their "3rd eye" it is a gland on top of their head that detects light/shadows. They need the dark/coolness to get the sleep and cool down that they need. As long as the night time temps don't dip below 65F all is good if it does get a CHE (Ceramic Heating Element) to keep temps up.
http://www.reptilesmagazine.com/Reptile-Health/Habitats-Care/Reptile-Lighting-Information/
Baby Dragons: Basking 100-107F warm 85-95F cool 70-75F
Juv Dragons: Basking anywhere from 95-107F Remember they need it to digest warm 85-95F cool 70F
Adults Basking 90-95F can also be low 100'sF warm 80-90F cool 70F

keep us posted - let us know how he's doin

So how should I keep him hydrated during brumation without force feeding?

 

[Canicke]

offer water / nutrition when he's awake. they WILL lose some hydration, but this is a normal process. they are not "hydrated" in nature. they sleep. we have altered their natural environment so try to compensate - most of the time, their lives are longer and better with us as care givers (they don't have to deal with lack of food or predators) you can only do what you can do ---

 

[PatsyB]

He's dehydrated because it's way too hot in his tank! Adults only need a basking spot of 95-98 degrees and like Canicke said, they don't feel heat on their belly so an under the tank heater could burn him and he wouldn't know it.

Keep track of his weight during brumation. The should only loose about 10% of their body weight. I have a girl that is dehydrated and she is in and out of brumation. I wake her up once a week and offer her some plain coconut water. It works like pedialyte and better than pedialyte, it's got a little sweetness to it so they tend to like to drink it.

 

[Ravenbrand]

He's dehydrated because it's way too hot in his tank! Adults only need a basking spot of 95-98 degrees and like Canicke said, they don't feel heat on their belly so an under the tank heater could burn him and he wouldn't know it.

Keep track of his weight during brumation. The should only loose about 10% of their body weight. I have a girl that is dehydrated and she is in and out of brumation. I wake her up once a week and offer her some plain coconut water. It works like pedialyte and better than pedialyte, it's got a little sweetness to it so they tend to like to drink it.

His temperatures have been the same for years and he's never been dehydrated, he got dehydrated because he went into brumation, and I never gave him water, and he stopped eating entirely because of brumation. And I have lowered the temps in his cage, the basking spot in his cage now stays around 101 degrees F.

 

[Hdrydr31]

His temperatures have been the same for years and he's never been dehydrated, he got dehydrated because he went into brumation, and I never gave him water, and he stopped eating entirely because of brumation. And I have lowered the temps in his cage, the basking spot in his cage now stays around 101 degrees F.

Honestly that's still too warm for an adult especially if his in full brumation. They need that temp drop, I would bring it down into the mid to high 90's the cool side can drop to 65F and be just fine. I would say try and drip or spritz water on his nose every so often to see if he will lick it up.

 

[Ravenbrand]

Honestly that's still too warm for an adult especially if his in full brumation. They need that temp drop, I would bring it down into the mid to high 90's the cool side can drop to 65F and be just fine. I would say try and drip or spritz water on his nose every so often to see if he will lick it up.

Took him to the vet today, and was confirmed he had low blood sugar, low red blood cells, low iron, and was anemic, and likely had either cancer or an infection. He went into ICU earlier. I got the call 3 hours ago that he has passed. He was a month short of 4 years old.

 

[Hdrydr31]

Oh no im very sorry to hear this..

Sent from my RS988 using Tapatalk

 

[Ravenbrand]

Oh no im very sorry to hear this..

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Thanks. Here are some pictures of his first year alive. He would've been 4 this April.

 

[PatsyB]

Thanks for sharing your photos with us. Sometimes it helps the healing to share their life with others.